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Author Topic: Plea for the HE staff  (Read 10109 times)

vobelic

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Plea for the HE staff
« on: October 24, 2010, 07:54:42 PM »

Hi,

First let me explain the situation.

I'd like to setup a regular 6to4 tunnel for my IPv4 address. Sadly my ISP is blocking ICMP Echo. PLEASE don't stop reading now!
To clarify ONLY ICMP Echo is blocked...

The problem is: tunnelbroker/HE has a policy of specifically requesting ICMP Echo verification to check if the host is up and not bogus.
Sadly I cannot influence my ISP...

I'm asking if You can allow me to create a tunnel with an alternate form of verification for the ipv4 endpoint.
I know there's a IPv4 verification method to see if you really own the host: http://tunnelbroker.com/ipv4_verify.php
I KNOW that method is only meant to check if you own the host that you're trying to set the tunnel endpoint to.

Why not let me verify my IP (that my host is up) with this method?
Let me upload a random string file on my webserver so i can perform the "fetch file" option and finally create the tunnel.

Any help is highly appreciated.

Best regards
« Last Edit: October 24, 2010, 08:01:05 PM by vobelic »
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vobelic

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2010, 07:00:53 PM »

Also

what's the point of this:

http://ipv4.tunnelbroker.net/ipv4_end.php?ipv4b=AUTO&pass=$MD5PASS&user_id=$USERID&tunnel_id=$GTUNID

If I you pick up my IP with AUTO then SURELY my host is reachable!
« Last Edit: October 25, 2010, 07:03:07 PM by vobelic »
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allen4names

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2010, 07:18:08 PM »

Please google "ping online" (without the quotes) so you can confirm that ping is being blocked. If so google "traceroute online" to find out where the IMCP packets may be being blocked and post the results. Note that most IP packets have at least two IP addresses. If tunnelbroker.net did not get your IP address it would not know where to send the response.
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vobelic

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2010, 07:23:25 PM »

Code: [Select]
--- PING 161.53.129.187 (161.53.129.187) 56(84) bytes of data. ---
From 193.198.162.2: icmp_seq=1 Packet filtered
From 193.198.162.2 icmp_seq=1 Packet filtered
From 193.198.162.2 icmp_seq=2 Packet filtered


--- 161.53.129.187 ping statistics ---
4 packets transmitted, 0 received, +3 errors, 100% packet loss, time 3001ms

Code: [Select]
traceroute to 161.53.129.187(161.53.129.187), 20 hops max, 40 byte packets
 1  208.64.252.229.uscolo.com (208.64.252.229)  0.331 ms  0.338 ms  0.388 ms
 2  208.64.248.17.uscolo.com (208.64.248.17)  0.740 ms  0.808 ms  0.854 ms
 3  ae5-148.edge5.LosAngeles1.Level3.net (4.71.142.65)  94.205 ms  94.225 ms  94.228 ms
 4  ae-34-80.car4.LosAngeles1.Level3.net (4.69.144.134)  0.808 ms ae-24-70.car4.LosAngeles1.Level3.net (4.69.144.70)  0.948 ms ae-34-80.car4.LosAngeles1.Level3.net (4.69.144.134)  0.988 ms
 5  globalcrossing-level3-10ge.LosAngeles1.Level3.net (4.68.110.66)  0.676 ms  0.783 ms  0.657 ms
 6  DANTE.tenGigabitEthernet1-3.ar2.VIE1.gblx.net (64.214.145.146)  169.424 ms  169.400 ms  168.846 ms
 7  carnet-gw.rt1.vie.at.geant2.net (62.40.124.10)  177.625 ms * carnet-gw.rt1.vie.at.geant2.net (62.40.124.10)  177.566 ms
 8  CN-Srce-03-ES.core.carnet.hr (193.198.238.106)  178.065 ms  178.358 ms  178.034 ms
 9  193.198.228.42 (193.198.228.42)  177.860 ms  177.819 ms  177.826 ms
10  CN-Irb.01-ES.core.carnet.hr (193.198.229.6)  178.022 ms  177.546 ms  177.729 ms
11  193.198.162.2 (193.198.162.2)  180.368 ms  180.396 ms  180.281 ms
12  lna6.irb.hr (161.53.129.187)  180.507 ms  180.445 ms  180.389 ms


As you can see ping fails on the last router on the network where my host lies.
The reason why traceroute passed may be because they used UDP probes!
« Last Edit: October 25, 2010, 07:25:16 PM by vobelic »
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cholzhauer

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2010, 07:26:45 PM »

SIXXS or GoGo6 have clients that work without the need to respond to ICMP.

I suggest going that direction.

SIXXS is large in Europe, and as long as you can work with the point system, would be a viable alternative.
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vobelic

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2010, 07:31:29 PM »

Isn't ICMP here used only as a measure to prevent bogus IP registrations?

If so i really am saddened that nobody of the staff understands my problem. A manual tunnel creation/edit shouldn't be a problem for someone from the staff.
It really is a pitty for i have static IP and a 100Mbps direct uplink on said host :(
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broquea

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2010, 07:40:29 PM »

1) I explained policy in the ticket you opened. If we make an exception for 1 person, it sets precedence for everyone else to ask for the same special treatment. So we avoid that.
2) That script auto-detects your IPv4 endpoint, but still requires it to respond properly to ICMP.

There are other options out there, even 6to4 which gives you a /48 instantly for your use without any broker registrations, and is based on your IPv4 address. You should be asking the provider when they are going to deliver IPv6 to their customers, so they know there is demand. And if they filter ICMP on IPv6 like they are with IPv4, expect a good portion of IPv6 breakage.
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vobelic

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2010, 08:00:43 PM »

I understand and respect that.

But at LEAST consider an alternative way to check host status eg. via UDP probes or TCP ack.
I'm sure there are more users out there whose ISP is overly paranoic and have ICMP disabled.

Gosh i would even pay you if could get that host to run your tunnel... Alternatives aren't that nice.
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broquea

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2010, 08:20:53 PM »

Gosh i would even pay you if could get that host to run your tunnel... Alternatives aren't that nice.

We sell a tunnel service, as well, which wouldn't require the same ICMP check as the free service. You can contact sales@he.net, or call 510-580-4190 Mon-Fri 8a-5p Pacific, for more information on locations and commit rates.
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vobelic

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2010, 08:30:15 PM »

Ok thanks, didn't know that!

But if it's that service that is paid 1$/Mbps that's an astronomical amount!
I just want to bypass that ICMP check and i'd pay for that. I'm not an ISP.
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snarked

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2010, 12:34:25 PM »

RE - Reply #3:  What does your traceroute look like if you use the "-I" option?

PS:  If your colo provider continues to block ICMP or protocol 41, would you consider moving to one that does permit such?  My colo provider allows such.  However, they are not in the downtown LA circle of providers that group around Grand and 7th/Wilshire (like your's does), but to the west in the Koreatown district (if you're interested).  They also seemed to have the best price when I last relocated in 2006.  They can offer space for 1U through a full cabinet.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2010, 12:37:34 PM by snarked »
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vobelic

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2010, 12:44:38 PM »

traceroute -I (forced ICMP probes) ends at 193.198.162.2 with packet filtered message...

Proto 41 isn't blocked!
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snarked

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2010, 10:51:21 AM »

Well, then it's not your traceroute source but "carnet.hr" which is blocking ICMP on your sample traceroute.  That's very bad for any ISP to do.  Such can cause all sorts of other problems.

I didn't realize you were tracing to yourself from an external point.
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vobelic

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2010, 12:58:03 PM »

I said from the beginning my ISP is the problem...

It's been blosked for 15 years now it seems... So far i never had any problems running all sorts of services (http, torrent tracker, ftp, ssh, you name it...).
Also I realise HE made this wretched ping policy not that long ago.
A fellow admin managed to establish a tunnel for a host on the same network a year ago or something without any problems.

@broquea I sent immediately as you suggested a mail to sales@he.net yet nobody responds...

I still don't understand why other methods of "pinging" cannot be used if that's a policy. Some of us who seriously work with networks yet their ISP netops being bastards are simply unfairly left in the dark.
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vobelic

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Re: Plea for the HE staff
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2010, 01:22:44 PM »

Update:

just checked, only INCOMING ICMP echo is blocked!
I can ping from the host, but my host cannot be pinged tho.
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